H&M generated Web help not visible in Opera 7

[Dave G]

The site works fine in IE, Netscape, Mozilla -- but is totally blank in Opera 7.

(I'm using Java-enabled Opera to check this).

If this gives any clues to anyone, Opera's Javascript error box reads:
"Event thread: onload
"Error:
"name: ReferenceError
"message: Security error: attempted to read protected variable"

Dave G.

[Tim Green]

The bad news is that the JavaScript system used to generate web-based help in H&M is not tested for Opera; basically it's optimised for IE.

The TOC system doesn't work at all in Opera 6 or lower. So far I've actually had quite good results in Opera 7 -- the TOC system works but a couple of other features are problematic. For example, drop-down text blocks cause parts of the topics to disappear because Opera isn't interpreting the <DIV> layers correctly.

You can test this with my online example of a browser-based system at:

http://www.it-authoring.com/samples.htm

If this works on your system then there's something about your project that's making Opera gag. On my system Opera 7 displays this more or less OK with the exception of the drop-down text blocks (for example in the Getting Organized topic in the Getting Started section.

[Dave G]

In my version of Opera 7, nothing of your project shows, either -- and the same error message is there.

There are so many unfamiliar (to this IE user) switches on Opera that I can't tell what's going on. The only thing I've done beyond install it and its Java enablement is to turn on the Java/Javascript error messages.

I gather, then, that Java or Javascript is not standardized after all?

In any case, the woraround seems to be to turn off the dynamic TOC in the Project Properties...

Dave G.

[Tim Green]

Just a thought: Did you also upgrade the Opera Java package when you upgraded to Opera 7? As far as I know there have been a lot of changes and if you still have the old version a lot of things won't work. I think it's also best to uninstall the old package before installing the new one.

I gather, then, that Java or Javascript is not standardized after all?

Unfortunately not. This has been the subject of many lawsuits, most recently between Sun and Microsoft. Just like HTML, every browser maker thinks they can bind users to them by creating their own "extensions" to JavaScript. The result is chaos -- if you try to standardise you support the Microsoft monopoly, which is now gaining frightening proportions, and if you try to support everything you drive your programmers nutso. The people at Opera are doing a pretty good job, better than Netscape ever did, but it's impossible to be perfect.

BTW: Opera is probably used by many more people than web statistics indicate because the default Opera setting identifies it as IE6 to avoid incompatibilities...

In any case, the workaround seems to be to turn off the dynamic TOC in the Project Properties...

That will solve most problems but you'll still have trouble with local JavaScript features like drop-down text and any other scripts you use...

[Dave G]

: Did you also upgrade the Opera Java package when you upgraded to Opera 7?

Yes - downloaded the Java package and the Opera package from the Opera site.

Since neither mine nor yours shows up in my Opera, there may some default switch or other that's causing this on my end -- but my site isn't working for other Opera users. So, no Javascript...

I'm using Windows 2000, if that makes any difference.

Thanks,

Dave G.

[Tim Green]

It occurs to me that it might be a security setting, although I can't find anything in Opera 7 Preferences other than JavaScript on or off (under Multimedia). Even so, I can imagine that there are levels of what JavaScript is permitted to do in Opera and if you've got quite a high security setting then Opera might not permit the TOC script to execute.

It might be an idea to check the "Open JavaScript console on error" option under Multimedia, then you might at least get some information about what's going on.

BTW: I'm running Opera 7 under XP Pro but I don't think there should be any problems under W2K -- must be something else...

[matthias]

Hi,

This actualy not a big problem. If H & M would generate the html output pages in the same order as the real tree-structure ( with folders and sub-folders on the loca harddisk ) then users could easily replace the dynamic H&M tree with another dynamic tree that works in NN 4 and higher, Opera 6/7 and higher and IE 4 and higher.

But what H&M does it just generating the html output in one big folder and completely unsorted, so nobody could ever replace the H&M tree structure with his own dynamic tree-script.

That is actualy sad because it reduces the possibilities to work with H&M . I reported that already a few times but there is probably no time for it.

A sorted output would be solution, so it would be possible to scan/index the saved structure on my own harddisk and just build my own cross-browser tree out of it. Now it is unsorted saved and there is no way to replace the H&M tree.

Best regards,
Matthias Jensen :cry: